12
Jul

Broadcast: "The Spiritually Examined Life"



well good evening my friends and welcome to this evening's broadcast and let's see I kind of wanted to look into something that might seem well it's very foundational and yet it's it's amazing how sometimes the most foundational parts of our spirituality can go remain unnoticed or undealt with and the the foundational part that I want to talk about tonight about spirituality is it really has to do with our fundamental kind of orientation to our whole spiritual life which I guess in the end really means to our life in general and there's a great temptation you know because we're all hooked up to not want to suffer to to have a life that feels good and secure and where we're happy maybe even more than happy and so it's really easy to for spirituality kind of get oriented around I guess you could say around the me and that's our hold our spiritual outlook becomes an outlook that's fundamentally oriented around all the various forms of dissatisfaction that the me might have and you know they're endless aren't they the the difficulties and the complaints that the me has and I'm not saying that some of those aren't entirely justified you know life's life can be a life can be a rocky ride at times at times it can be a very very rocky ride and it leaves its it leaves its marks and sometimes those marks are from the past and sometimes those marks those scars might be forming in the present moment so it's not that having the I could think about it it of like the the me-centered agenda to dominate spirituality is in one sense understandable it's I guess you could say it's almost even expected to a certain extent but this is a really important sort of foundational question of what are our orientation is – well let's just start with our spiritual life ultimately it would be life in general because as far as I'm concerned the spiritual life is life that the spiritual part of life really just refers to the examined life the life that's looked at deeply and profoundly its spiritual has to do with the sense of the contemplative dimension that we bring to life you know so spirituality it's true sense isn't some separate segment of life and I think this is sometimes the most challenging thing to really you know come to grips with because it's really common for any spiritual teacher to you know we often get lots of questions about that are really in the end derived from spirituality being related to as a sort of segment of one's life now if that's the way you want to relate to it then you're perfectly I invite you to do so if that's what you want but it can only take you so far you know and so as I said one of the most important things in in in spirituality and in life is the basic question is what is my fundamental orientation to life what is my fundamental orientation to my inner life and what is the fundamental orientation to what we call my outer life that orientation is one of the most profound questions one of the most profound inquiries we can have and and it's it's so vital to how deep the thread of our realization will go and how integrated into life it will ultimately become you know so it's kind of a there's kind of this paradox or maybe you could think of it as kind of a balance between the me oriented desire not to suffer right to to have its life problems solve to have its its its its fears calmed to have its anxieties soothed to have its confusions clarified to have its past rectified you know all these are sort of the the orientation of what the me would hope to get out of it actually there are the orientation of what the me hopes to get out of anything really and it's not that this is somehow bad or wrong it's just that it's limited and I think in the modern world I notice that there's a lot of misunderstanding about this sort of fundamental orientation of spirituality because it's really common to encounter all sorts of spiritual teachings that sometimes do nothing but orient themselves around the me in its constant state of dissatisfaction but really spirituality I mean the word spiritual suggests a a reality or a dimension of being that is that is transpersonal that is that's that's beyond the personal that's that's not dominated and not fundamentally oriented around the me it's one of the reasons we talk of kind of the freedom that's experienced and many sense the freedom that we realize is not the freedom from the world or free freedom for others or it's actually the freedom from the tyrannical little me and it's constant search for happiness in all the ways that it it moves in the world and you know certainly we can see this in the world all around us what life looks like when its oriented around the me whether the me is wanting everyone to agree with it whether the me is wanting unending happiness whether the meze wanting power or control whether the Me's well it's doing whatever it does I think the operation of this me if you look around you if you look at the world around you it's a it's very very obvious you you can see what's what's driving so much of life for human beings right and this leads to ultimately it leads to deep and profound consequences not just individually but also collectively and so this fundamental orientation is one of the most central questions of spirituality and it's not when I say it's foundational it doesn't mean that it's sort of elementary that you only look at say at the very beginning it's it's something that we you kind of it's useful to check upon all along the way what is my fundamental orientation am I am I actually just being led around by the Me's endless search for satisfaction in all the various ways that it does that and is that dominating my spiritual orientation or the orientation of my life because when that's the case of course what it leads to like I said it's not that it's right or wrong or good or bad it's just that it leads to well I suppose the Buddha were to call it unsatisfactoriness it's ultimately unsatisfactory and and that's about the best you can say about it you know from there it just goes downhill right Hey ignorance greed violence domination control on and on a go so to say that it leads to dissatisfaction as sort of the the most mild way that you can just describe the consequence of the life that's oriented only around the me now it's not that you can therefore see that and just discount it right because if you just try to discount the me then of course it's always sort of pulling at you it's it's it's always looking for resolution but here's the difference between spirituality and a lot of the more me oriented therapies which most therapies they are and that's why they're actually pretty useful because they're some of them are actually pretty good at getting the me to be more less divided less in conflict more more happy right but like I said there's a limitation the thing that makes spirituality what it is is because of its orientation its orientation of spirit spirit means you could think of it as simple that which transcends the personal self if we didn't want to get into any kind of flowery language or descriptions you could think of the spiritual as that which is beyond or transcends the personal self right and one of the things we are all confronted with a big part of especially in the beginning or for maybe sometimes quite a long time is we're trying to come to that to have a direct experience that shows us in our own experience that there is indeed a domain of consciousness you could say that is not that is not oriented towards nor dominated by the me it's it's transcendent of the me now just because you realize that doesn't mean the me necessarily disappears sometimes that's to some people's can create disappointment that that the me doesn't just immediately disappear but that's what makes spirituality spiritual because it's fundamental orientation is not found within the me and so it's it's not being it's not being led around by the by the dictates of the me but if you're not careful spirituality can easily become something that's just endlessly responding to the dissatisfactions of the me I think one of the one of the things that's so important and sometimes it's quite eye-opening is when we start to have involve ourselves in some sort of a contemplative dimension to life and contemplative dimension you can think of it as just when we start to orient ourselves towards quiet that's what to contemplate in the sense that I'm using the word isn't necessarily is it's not to sit around and think about something it's actually to kind of abide in that state of being which is already and always beyond the me it's sort of sometimes I think of it as the the context within which the the me arises and expresses itself and also disappears at times so if you think of the spiritual dimension to life right it's you could think of it as is the life that's beyond the me which is 99.9 percent of life right the the me even though it can seem to dominate so much of human experience and human history and and drive it with its with its endless dissatisfaction that spirituality comes from a recognition that that's not all there is to life that's not all there is to you in fact even though at times the me can seem quite loud and large and boisterous but it's actually just a a fraction just a fraction within a fraction of something within consciousness it can seem to be all present pervasive because the me can be so noisy and I don't mean just the thoughts in your mind but its reactivity emotionally and psychologically you know it can be so noisy that it can seem to sort of obliterate everything other than itself right because the me has very little interest in what lies beyond itself in the contemplative dimension of of life of existence and also of of who you are of who each each one of us really is and so any spirituality any any contemplative form of spirituality or inner form of spirituality of course it'll be we'll be dealing with sort of me oriented psychological issues will will come up right that's and in one way or the other they they'll need to be dealt with right so it's not like you just try to dismiss dismiss the me and all of its hang-ups and and everything and just pretend that it's not there that really doesn't work either right so you have this this odd kind of paradox that if the me dominates your your orientation it tends to lead to a a life that's inherently unsatisfactory right and yet we can't just simply dismiss the me and all of its psychological baggage and just try to say well it's an illusion which it may be but just to say that it's an illusion doesn't in and of itself resolve it so in Zen we would call this a kind of Cohen kind of life Cohen you know it's when you seem to have these irreconcilable opposites that are simultaneously present but having said that still one of the most important things about spirituality is to get clear on what is my orientation is it being led around kind of like a dog on a leash by the endlessly unsatisfied dissatisfied me with its almost endless array of problems and confusion is that actually is that what's dictating the orientation of my life and and spirituality specifically of my spiritual life it's really worth looking at and I think one of the reasons a lot of people don't look at this closely is because it's very hard for them to even contemplate what I'm saying without being judgmental about what they find or feeling ashamed about what they find right so judgment and shame is one of the most powerful ways that the me Orient's all attention towards itself right because then all of a sudden you're not really talking about anything other than trying to help the me feel better about itself so just just to notice that or just to acknowledge it if it seems to be part of your experience as I said I think the proper orientation even though the me or the what a psychological self will will need to be dealt with will be a part of one's life when spiritual life but still the question of what's my orientation now you notice that the like could you say the most forms of spirituality really it there at their heart have a have a transcendent orientation and by transcendent I don't mean to suggest that it that's like some sort of getting lost in the clouds not some sort of you know not just populated with a bunch of spiritual fantasies I don't mean transcendent in that way and I don't mean transcendent in the sense of apart from that's often a misunderstanding two people are seeking to transcend so they can get away from that's not really authentic transcendence right if you're just transcending something to get away from it you may do that temporarily but it's really not authentic so in the end it doesn't really end up working out very well because eventually what you transcend if there's a lack of resolution that's still there it's gonna keep pulling you back out of your kind of transcendent States so I've really been focusing this on this a lot this year you know I am through a lot of the stuff that we've done even the teachings that I've done quite a bit even on the internet around you know looking at ones one of the ways I've I've we've looked at trying to look at trying to establish a good orientation as tor to look at the the the values for instance that come directly from the deepest state of being truth love compassion clarity service there are any number of them there that they are they're just sort of values that are inherent in being as such right they're inherent in being there not necessarily inherent in ego but their inherent in the truth of being in a good form of spirituality will give will give kind of voice and structure to those sort of self transcending values so I've talked about that any number of times quite a bit this year I'm just using that for an example I'm not going to get into describing those at the moment but I've noticed that even after people have had sometimes even very deep and very profound spiritual experiences a lot of times there's those assert to a certain extent though often still be have some sort of struggle it may be much subtler than after they had some big spiritual shift but nonetheless it's often still there between these two fundamental orientations you see because to give you an example of how the meek and the me orientation can still kind of get in there and dominate your spiritual life even after you've had some big spiritual shift the me comes in and says I had this big shift last week or last year or whenever and now what I want to have now because it's never fully satisfied so now what I want to have is I want to be in that perspective that I realized last week I want to have that wonderful feeling of expansion and wholeness and connection I want to have that all the time and that seems completely reasonable doesn't it like who wouldn't want that and especially when you've had some of these deeper realizations you know the the domains of consciousness that you can experience can be extraordinarily Pleasant and anything that's extraordinarily pleasant is highly addicting to the me to the psychological self so the psychological self some even after a big awakening experience at some point we'll come in there and I'll say here well here's what I want now I had that experience I want to live that all the time I want to experience that not necessarily live it but I want to experience it all the time how do I stay in that experience like I said it's a it seems like a completely irrelevant question but it's sneaky because if you really look at that question you realize that it's oriented around the me or the psychological self it's the me still looking for something now it's trying to hold on to a realization right and so if you just if I as a teacher was just to say to someone well here's how you hold on to that experience you had last week all the time I would just be playing into this me oriented self and this isn't really what the heart of spirituality is I remember I made a comment many times over the years but I remember years ago me and Mukti my wife we we did a weekend intensive and it was it was a local intensive here and and we called it we titled it servants of truth and it was all about how to basically how to serve that which you realized and what was funny about it is when I and I when I came up with the title and I wrote the description and I knew like whom I wonder how many people would be interested in this because it was it was a very obvious declaration of an orientation which is not me centered right and so I had we up came that that intensive and I probably think we we got about one-third of the normal peak of the people showed up that would normally show up and that really told me something and even the people that did show up half of them probably were still kind of having some sort of reactive struggle even with the mere word of service to be a servant of truth right the me like I don't want to be a servant I want to be served if it's honest usually they're not that honest with you but it's certainly than me doesn't serve a servant of truth that doesn't sound like freedom so I actually did that at the time I did it as a kind of experiments I wanted to see where people were at I wanted to see where what what is people's fundamental orientation here and so I intentionally you know came up with the title I came up with and we came up with a subject matter and part of it was not only wanting to teach on it but part of it was actually wanting to see okay how are people gonna relate to this and it was really eye-opening to see how little interest there was in serving the truth that you realize now if I when I would come up with a title you know realize the truth of your being okay that's gonna fill the room serve the truth of your being okay now half the people are going to show up maybe a third maybe a quarter and this this is a really really important thing I think for us to really look at now that was years ago and I'm happy to say that in the years since that was probably more than 10 years ago maybe 12 or 13 years ago but in that time I've noticed in this in the Sangha this spiritual community this the the people who who come to see and hear me teach that they've the Sangha has become more and more and more and more open to what I consider a kind of more and more and more mature spiritual orientation right less and less me oriented which is really that's really wonderful because that tells me there's sort of an evolution that's happened out there and the people who come to see me and I'm really you know happy about that then that that that there's I can teach about things now that 15 years ago when I would try to teach about him nobody be interested in fact sometimes there would be a distinct like no we won't go on to hear about that and so there was a whole host of things that I just you know said well okay I guess nobody wants to hear about this I'll teach on something a little bit different for awhile and I'll just see if the if the atmosphere changes over time and sure enough you know I've been teaching 22 years now and and the atmosphere has changed and there's been enough people that have had enough deep experience and they've lived with that and that they've started to mature I think more out of this sort of self orientation because like I said you can still have a me centered orientation about your own awakening right about your own awakening one of the most common or frequent dangers of spiritual awakening itself is inflation or you have an awakening beyond the me but the me grabs it and says that's what I am right it's different when the primordial ground of your being is recognizing itself and it's saying to itself ah that's what I am that's one thing when the me comes in and tries to grab that and own it and possess it and say that's what I am the words might be the same but the inner orientation is completely different so all traditions have known for a long long time that one of the dangers of awakening itself because there are dangers inherent within awakening just like they're daring dangers inherent and thing else in life one of them is is a kind of inflation right and another one is to relate to your own moments of clarity let's say as sort of objects things that you want to say sustained instead of an orientation that would be a little bit more I'm not pardon me with my words because I can only kind of suggest what I'm trying to point out here but an orientation that would be a little bit more how is it that I could serve best serve best be an expression of best be an embodiment of right the the the deepest or most profound things that I feel that I know or and have experienced you know and that's a different orientation than how do I continually hold on to the experience of it that's a very limited orientation and it ultimately leads to frustration but when there's just that little shift of orientation towards something like what might it mean to endeavor to embody what I've realized then you're then you're taking something upon yourself rather than trying to hold on or reproduce an experience because I think it's it doesn't take much insight to see that the desire to hold on and read and repeat an experience endlessly is fundamentally an egoic drive now often when you have any kind of insight you that'll be part of it your course you'll want to have that experience it can be very pleasant and very enlivening and all of that so it's not that that's that that shouldn't happen or something it's but it's a it's it's important at any of these critical moments to see but what is my when you have a desire or a yearning that like what is the orientation where is it where is it coming from is it coming from that which can never really be satisfied you know cuz the me will say if I only had a spiritual awakening then everything you know I promise I'll let go and everything well I won't I won't want anymore just like saying if I get what I want then I won't want anymore well then you get some powerful experience and more times than not and the me comes back and said I'd like to have that again please I'd like to have more of that or whatever it is and again it's neither right nor wrong it's just noticing that that these certain orientations are inherently unsatisfying and before we get too quick with looking at what we want to happen it's it's even more important to look at what's the orientation of our own desiring that's extremely important because that that keeps us when we really have that in the in the forefront of our consciousness in the forefront of our our concern it helps protect us from what the Tibetan teacher Troopa rinpoche called spiritual materialism where we relate to spirituality in terms of what can it get me that's what spiritual materialism is it's to take materialism the the viewpoint of materialism and just transfer it into spirituality and the fundamental orientation is basically what can this do for me that's spiritual materialism and it has a real limitation then when you start to notice that if you notice that when it occurs in you the mere fact that you notice it means you have options right if you don't notice it and it's just moving in you and you've never really taken a look at it you never become conscious of it well then you're just captured by it in a certain sense you're possessed by it but as soon as you notice it it means you start to have an option because you can ask yourself is that the orientation that feels the most aligned with the deepest part of my being that feels the most line aligned with the deepest part of our being and so this isn't like I said this this issue of orientation of where's my where's my spiritual orientation and ultimately where as well what's my life orientation cuz you know the most unhappy people are the people that are looking for happiness and everything they do and not only looking at it all often there's this unconscious demand for it and this this underlying sense of anger that they're not getting the happiness that they want that's that's a very common orientation of life it's kind of one of those weird things the more the more you seek to be happy the more you make being happy your goal the less happy you are because in a certain sense when you're just looking for happiness then whatever the situation you're in or whatever you're encountering you're measuring it against the happiness that you hope to derive from it you know the happiest people I've noticed aren't really oriented towards happiness happiness is just a byproduct of them being oriented in a oriented in the fundamental ground of being not oriented in the endlessly wanting psychological self so that's kind of one of those strange things the happiest people you could say all they're happy of course they're not look they're not looking for happiness because they are happy but that may not be as true as some people think it seems reasonable of course they're not looking for happiness they're happy but what I observe is the most happy people the people that are that's happiness is not necessarily dependent on whatever the current situation the happiness that's a underlying state of being right rather than just tied to getting what you want those people though they're not oriented towards endlessly trying to be happy there's a different orientation they have a self-transcending orientation about them and that's that's a really useful thing to to observe so what is that self-transcending orientation well at the at the beginning this is just the tip of the iceberg of course but you know and if you think of the self having getting down to these two orientations the orientation can either be what can I get which is can I get happiness can I have can I get experience of God can I you know some orientation where the me is looking for something that it that it wants that it thinks is going to make it happy so what do I want let's just say that's one orientation what I want and the other orientation would be would be the question what am I now I've noticed over the years that when somebody's fundamental orientation is what I want they're really not interested in the more existential question of their own nature of who they are just like I don't really care who I am I just want to have this experience or have that experience or feel this way or foil that way I'm not actually interested in Who I am right and again I'm not making this right or wrong I'm just saying that that orientation is a very limited orientation it's an orientation that's coming from the psychological self and very often will kind of trap you in the psychological self right the deeper orientation this isn't the only way the deeper orientation shows up but one of the ways it shows up is when you start to wonder what is that what is this me that's always wanting it comes out of a kind of observation of life this is what compelled the Buddha for instance on his search when he when he noticed that one of the things he noticed that in life there is this seemingly constant thread of dissatisfaction that's woven throughout life you know there's lots of dissatisfactory things that that happen and he didn't ask can I come upon something so satisfactory that I'll never feel dissatisfied again because he had it he already had an insight that showed him like that that's not possible you're not going to cure this dissatisfaction by having yet just something added to you that this is dissatisfaction is inherent in the egocentric perspective it's just inherent if you have a very unhealthy ego than the sense of dissatisfaction is very strong and very overt and if your ego is much more much healthier more mature ego your sense of dissatisfaction is much much less and it doesn't mean that all of life is to settle is unsatisfactory right there's still in the most egoic orientation there are still moments of happiness and joy for sure but but it's but woven through the fabric of the egocentric orientation is dissatisfaction so once when when the Buddha saw that for instance that's what compelled his search because his question was like well is is that it is that all there is to life that Here I am a human being noticing that this life seems to be this threat of dissatisfaction cease beat seems to be woven through the fabric of life that there's there's there's no way to seemingly avoid this and is that it is there any deeper resolution to the question of suffering so right there with that question is there a deeper resolution it's a that is not an egocentric orientation the Orient the egocentric orientation is just how do I feel better I don't care if there's disaster dissatisfaction woven through life I want to feel better right now right like I said that's totally understandable we've all felt that hundreds of times thousands of times hundreds of thousands of times probably but it's just that to see that so when the ego and when Buddha had that observation hmm this Dada dissatisfaction seems seems to be woven through the fabric of human existence he wasn't saying can I find a big enough experience that's going to satisfy me it was like is there is that it let me see if I can find out let me let me plunge into the depth of my being not necessarily in search of a higher experience just for its own right but to see if there is a deeper resolution to this existential issue that all human beings seem to share that human life seems to be that seems to be woven through human human's life all human beings is there any deeper truth than this and you see how one is kind of a curiosity that's the question itself is is already leaning beyond the egocentric orientation just the question itself is already oriented in a different direction it's not oriented towards the the me saying but I just want to feel good now and you know that's that's it and I really don't I'm really not interested in the deeper existential issues of humanity you know I just wanted I just want to feel as good as I possibly can that's the orientation that catches most human beings that's that's what they're living to varying degrees as I said some are living it out chaotically and in misery and some are much more mature autonomous and the dissatisfaction as a is is not an overt part of their life but nonetheless it's still there and with or without just that was just the Buddhist calling right he just happened to be motivated by that observation the the spiritual impulse doesn't have to be motivated by suffering at all when I had my when I had the the spiritual when spirituality really hit me over the head and all of a sudden I was sort of seized with a with a with a seemingly great spiritual quest it wasn't really derived from suffering from the attempt to note to not suffer probably at some level like anybody I I would I didn't want to have to suffer unnecessarily but that wasn't the the the overt driving force it wasn't so I didn't have a same driving force or someone like the Buddha did which was he was really looking to the issue of of suffering for me it was was the the truth of the truth of being because what I had what I knew from different experiences growing up that would happen from time to time spontaneously what I knew was there are different perspectives entirely different perspectives on life right we can be in sort of the egoic perspective and life looks one way but quite suddenly it can shift and all the sudden life looks very very very different and having had some of those just little foretaste you know growing up it it ultimately led me to be really the question right but it has it was but the way that we see you in beings tend to experience life is just one fundamental perspective you know and because it's common because most everybody perceives life through that egocentric lens we tend to think well that's it we just do the best we can within that perspective but what I had had glimpses of was that that perspective wasn't the only perspective there were other ways of looking at an experiencing life and I was that's what I got intrigued by and because you can see that the egocentric perspective even if it didn't look at it from a personal point of view in terms of your own difficulty let's say but you look out into the world what I looked out into the world and I looked at as a teenager and I looked into the world and I saw the way human beings behave towards one another and my question is jeez is there a better way to be is there a better way to be than this if there is I would love my life to con to contribute something other than what seems to be so common in human beings right I mean at the time I wasn't thinking in it this way but I would now look back and say you they're anything other than the egocentric perspective even the the mature well-adjusted ego perspective is there is there is there a different way a different basis from which to live and I had had glimpses but I didn't really understand those glimpses but they were just enough to show me that I think there are other possibilities and so that was my inclination right and everybody has their own the young the the where their yearning comes from and I would say many people probably most people well undoubtedly most people that I meet that certainly initially their spiritual search is one of the one of the driving interests of it is you know not wanting to suffer so much and so that's why I said this is neither good or bad or right or wrong it's just start to see that that seems to be what motivate gets probably 90% of the people if not more than that sort of into a into an investigation of life that's that's deep and possibly profound right so suffering can can deeply motivate that so II but even though that that that can pull us into spirituality and that can be relevant for us for a certain period of time it's also important to see that it also has its limitation you can indeed that perspective can indeed be very useful because it can cause you to look at your thoughts and your identity and all your assumptions and you can why am I doing this well because I want to feel better okay so we we utilize that right but what's really important you can utilize the desire not to want to suffer but you can utilize it to take you beyond that say right to get you to ask deeper questions to did get you to peer deeper into yourself into your being than you have before the desire to not want to suffer can can do that but if it but if the desire to not want to suffer to not only not suffer but to get what I want you know what I mean whether you want success or what's the right job to choose or how to find my soulmate or you know all these sort of sort of me oriented perspectives if it remains confined to that domain will only go so far will only go so far and so it's one of the conscious decisions I've made probably in the last year or so that I'm I'm speaking more and more and more and more I'm just orienting my teaching towards those whose spiritual yearning is not generated entirely from the egocentric perspective like how do i how do I like I said how do I get the best job how do I meet the right person how do I be happy all the time how do I this sort of laundry lists of wants and desires and I just probably the last I mean I've always inclined towards this scent but certainly in the last year I just thought okay I'm really gonna orient this teaching even more I'm you know oriented teaching entirely really in a self transcendent orientation that doesn't mean it won't address self oriented difficulties or problems but they're not going to be the fundamental orientation of the tea King they never have been but I think it's I think you if you've been paying attention you might have noticed it's be gone more and more and more in this this other direction and then we start because it unlocks worlds of possibilities it really unlocks worlds of possibilities now of course if the if the if the if the me is like I said too conflicted then it's got to get to a to a certain state not a state of happiness total happiness and peace and bliss but just to a certain level of coherence before it can really truly be usually really interested in in what lies beyond it so that's of course that if you know if you're starving to death and you're living in a war zone and you know all you know is misery those issues are going to be the most relevant issues to your life don't trying to find a safer place to be and food to eat and shelter over your head and you know clothing on your back and of your family and your children or whatever of course then that orientation is completely relevant that's in one sense that what you should be oriented around because you need to be but that's certainly not the majority that people who come to me and far from it and even if we feel like we've got a real conflicted me open to the possibility that part of that conflict could be generated from your your orientation the the the place from which you're in relationship to that conflict friends you can either want to start to discover so the the underlined truths which might of course start to relieve the suffering and when we're looking for underlying truths what that really means is I'm willing to see my own illusions right if we can say I want the truth but we don't really want to see our illusions that means we don't really want the truth we just want our idea of the truth but when we really want the deeper truth it means I'm willing to see my illusions and through seen through our illusions actually we dispel immense amounts of suffering unnecessary suffering or we could say why don't I'm not really interested in the truth I'm not really interested in my illusions I just want to feel better and if that's the case well of course if that's the case then my teachings not really gonna be that relevant to that person but here's the thing since you and I and all of us we are not to be defined by the psychological self the psychological self isn't who we are it may be something that's happening in your consciousness it may be something that's experiencing you may be experiencing your little me but everything about your little me is non-essential which means it's an experience it it comes it goes so that in one sense that's the good news that who we are is already transcendent of the psychological self because who you are is who you are who you are is not who you can become it's who you are and who you are has to be who you are now as much as it will ever be at any other point in time now who you might become can of course change over time and grow and expand or shrink and contract but the ultimate foundation of our being is already and always self-transcending if there is a ego itself it exists within who we are and that's a very different perspective than thinking your little ego itself is who you are but no it's actually within who you are so that's why I wanted to start just just a kind of to talk about this so you just start to kind of look so you just start to like I said I would try not to have any judgement about what you find or anything like that because that that's that makes us unconscious right when we judge when we become judgemental I mean of course in life there are times to make wise judgments or discriminations but in this when you I'm talking about being judgemental when if you get judgmental about yourself the judgmentalism itself is a form of going unconscious so see if you can not be at all judgmental about it and just look what is my what is my fundamental orientation of my spiritual life I I tune in I turn on my computer and I look this little guy audio Shantay is staring back at me I'm this creaky and why why am i doing this why did I turn it on why am i listening to this guy what's my orientation what am i what am I looking what am I looking for right what am i what am i tuning in for writing and you just start to look at that that starts to show you that's what the what the fundamental orientation is and all I'm saying that at any point along the way it is possible at any point to reorganize your orientation of especially when you see like what the Buddha saw that the me centered orientation is is it has suffering inherent to it when you finally get that if you get nothing but that then that itself I mean starts to engender your your interest starts to go beyond it starts to go bigger than it oh oh this endless non ending search for satisfaction or the unending search for love or the unending search for approval or the unending search for acknowledgement or whatever it is oh it's unning there's no end to it intrinsically what's intrinsically part of it is this sort of dissatisfaction because in some sense there's never enough and when you see that then the the grab the grasping on it starts to loosen and then spirituality comes longing suggests that there's more to you than that that's the good news there's more to you than that that that doesn't define you at all really and right there you start to make that transition to a to a different orientation to a self-transcending orientation right which doesn't mean that you're not concerned at all about your happiness or well-being of course you are you know of course you are even if you're pretending not to care you you do care you you kind of can't not but that that isn't then dominating the whole the whole picture right there so I want to invite you if anybody wants to call in talk to me about this subject feel free use the right number there's one for a US and Canada and there's also an international number which is for everywhere else make sure you use the right number to call in takes a few minutes to get the call screened and up on my computer screen so while that's happening I'm just gonna see if I can go through a couple of these emails briefly and I got a I got AI always get a lot of emails so thank you for that I got a lot of emails that were long like page long questions and I haven't said it for a while so I might remind you that more often than not if I get a page long question it's hard for me to answer now the first one I'm gonna read from is admittedly a page long question but I'm not gonna read it all to you but most of the page long questions even though some of them were you know gray tips I'm not using them because it's hard to discern there's often three or four questions in which one's the most relevant and I don't necessarily want to read through an entire page while I'm doing this program so the shorter and more concise you can make the questions there is a greater chance that I will bring it to this to this program and be able to respond to it although admittedly I'm only able to respond at least in like this directly to very very few of them percentage-wise of what I get often when I'm giving a talk my talk is actually derived from different emails that I've read as well sometimes what I show up thinking I'm going to talk about so I'm often answering any number of emails or trying to respond to them during the opening talk but this one is it's kind of interesting and I'm not going to read the whole thing because it's a whole page I'm just gonna read a few sentences of the question dear all yeah I'm in a process of profound inquiry about the nature of this self already right so which is self with a big s that's a self-transcending orientation right there and I'm stunts and I stumbled upon a limit I feel that my effort in the inquiry could bring me only up to this point and now I'm helpless to go beyond it so brought it brought Gabriel up to a point and seemed like a limitation how do I go beyond it I'm gonna go down now and we get to the question what I am must be beyond all that because it must be who or what is watching perception because was describing some experience and realizing oh who I am must be beyond that particular observation or that particular experience because there's a there's a perception or a perceiving or a perceiver that's prior to all of it right good good thing to notice but how can I know something that cannot be perceived good question and who is going to know it here is the limit as the wall I can't go further than that as this appears to me the edge of what can be known yes mentally I have a sort of intuition about that ultimate nature it must be the disappearance of the watcher a fusion between subject and object and what's being asked here is and many of you I'm sure have been here or you might be here where you you start to look into your own nature what am I and before you looked into it we define ourselves through what I call a content of experience thoughts ideas beliefs feelings emotions experiences all these things are objects are for perception and there's something prior to them mainly the perceiving of them right but then here's the here's the riddle here's the limit how do I perceive that because you can't make the perceiving into a perception you then that just becomes another object from which there is a prior perception of or perceiver of how do I recognize that which I can't perceive that's the heart of the question now this question came out of some some really deep inquiry and even more than deep inquiry some real contemplation of the question so I know that because of where Gabriel got to with this question like oh there's all these things that I can perceive even internal subtle things all my Dia's about myself and all of that and I might have an intuition that I'm somehow before that maybe something like the perceiver of all that but I can't perceive the perceiver then you can't get this Eve perceiver out there and make an object out of it and right there you feel like boom you hit a wall it's kind of like being checkmated if you're playing chess all of a sudden you realize it can't move forward or backward or up or down or one side or another side and just at that place just and you just stopped looking for consciousness as an object the only object you will see is whatever form consciousness assumes as soon as it takes a form you're conscious of it but consciousness itself and if you just stop there when you get yourself to that kind of limit the limit of the mind the frontier of what's of what the mind can compare a trait of what thought can understand when you get there the important thing you know is just stop right there stop in the middle of that inquiry yes consciousness is not something that you can see you can't get a part of it and if you just stop the-the-the attempt to perceive the perceiving is frustrated as it needs to be and you just let it be frustrated and you just let go because that last happening you can't make happen that's why we call it grace it's not grace because you know God decides to give you favor on a certain day it's just that which you can't force to happen when you get to that place those of you who might be there that's important to know once you get there just stop there don't say don't don't say oh there's nothing I can do and then just be done with it and go on and dismiss it and say well it'll happen if it happens a lot of people do that now non-duality you know no no no when you get to that kind of limit stop there that's that's your contemplation just be perfectly still right there don't try to grasp because anything you can grass will be an object and it will be temporary so you're no longer grasping and the grasping then recedes back into its home ground we recognize our true nature not as an object and how do we recognize that that's very difficult to explain it's like consciousness becoming aware of itself but not as an object just the self recognition the self recognition can happen without consciousness trying to become an object it can just happen throughout the whole of consciousness consciousness recognizes this is what I am I can't see what I am I can't reach out and grasp it but I can spontaneously intuitively know that this awareness is the ground of my own being so we just start right there okay I hope to have a time to get to one or two more but I'm going to go to a couple phone calls let's go to line three I think it's Michelle from Australia hi hi yeah where are you calling me for my question is just over a year ago I downloaded one of your old courses I think it was called uncensored straight fork and I heard you're teaching about transmuting and I have been sent my body my whole system seems to voluntarily just kind of do that a huge amount i've also listen to your redemption of courses and I found that really profound and it really helped me and I had an abusive childhood so I think all this stuff is helping me work through that not the question the reason why I'm calling and in relation to today's topic is sometimes I feel that the transmuting process is so strong and and it seems to be so involuntary and automated that it just kind of takes over all other types of spiritual practice and in so doing it does seem to yes it is self transcendent but it's also obviously going into the suffering of the self yeah and I just want to kind of check that I'm on the right track I mean I kind of I also sit in silence every day and I really do feel something transcended from that experience that's really the core of my practice has been about the trans meetings since I did that course maybe over a year ago and I just kind of sometimes wonder is there a more should I I don't know like am I getting so caught up in this should I be doing something else yeah yes really what I'm asking okay great question I really appreciate that question because it because it goes right to the sort of paradox at the heart of this whole thing right more so so sure when the the transmuting of emotion I don't really have touch you know what it is I don't have time to go into it right now with everybody else that's listening but I've talked about the transmit moment really in one sense the transmuting of an experience happens in large part through the simple willingness to have it you know without without resistance without getting lost in endless narrative and all the rest you know without resistance without indulgence without narrative but just just the willingness to have raw experience and this this transmission thing happens you don't make it happen as you know it just there's something that just happens we are hooked up in such a way that if we can get ourselves out of the way that our whole body mind is very adept at a kind of natural purification right and that's really what the transmutation of an emotion is and you can transmute sometimes a negative emotion it's not necessarily that they just go away but they transmute or reveal their other side right so just for the people listening for instance without saying exactly how it's done beyond what I just did you can transmute angry in the willingness say to just experience the raw naked energy of anger in your body if you can at the moment you can really just experience it purely the what is nosov it all the sudden it can transmute and it kind of shows its other potential which is total clarity now most people think anger makes them very unclear and that's true most most people do because they're most people when they get angry they are either indulging it which is usually what they're doing some people are trying to deny it and so it never gives you the opportunity for it to transmute to show that there can be incredible clarity in anger and it can also the fact that often when we are angry it's because we care about something and if we can find what does it that I love so much that I care so much that I'm willing to be angry about once you find that then also you've had the transmutation of anger into love or caring and you can see what you care about okay so that's just to orient the audience a little bit so when this starts to happen yeah most people will go through a real process and that process can be well it's frequently months and it can often and sometimes it can be years and most people will kind of go in and out of it like they'll be in this place where certain emotions are being transmuted or let go of and it starts to just happen more or less spontaneously once you really get the hang of it it just starts to happen and that's entirely appropriate like I said because it lasts weeks or months or sometime a few years that's fine right that's fine the I think where your question is coming with what I talked to today is there will come a time there will come a point and I'd love you to call me when this point comes there will come a point neither one of us knows when that point comes and neither one of us can predict when it comes they'll come a point when if you're really sensitive you'll just kind of feel like huh it just seems to be kind of done and that doesn't mean that it couldn't continue because we can be the thing about our psychological process is we can be involved in healing our process forever there can be no end to it but there's a certain point where kind of our own intuitive or contemplative wisdom just starts to feel like okay it just feels like there's enough resolution where the time to move on just becomes obvious now the only way that you would keep it you know in a sense that would be like self oriented let's say would be if like some people can just get so into it that they just keep doing and doing and doing it and doing it and doing it and you know it can go on sort of like I said it can go on indefinitely and most people I mean everybody goes through their own psychological process right it's part of spiritual work you're sparse psychological process will will occur and and we'll look for its resolution and so of course you participate that and the wisest way you can but the point will come when you just kind of feel oh it just seems to be ready to move on and you'll feel it and right at that point you'll you'll notice like oh okay this is a kind of decision point I could go forever in it or I could just notice that okay I think I seem to be moving on I remember talking to a friend of mine I've talked to a number of people that I know who are psychologists but one of them was a good friend and he went to psychology in his early 20s and and got great benefit by going to a good therapist and such a great benefit that he went to school and trained as a psychologist and now he's working psychologist and I told asked him one day I said so when you were getting all that benefit when did you know that it was time for you to move on because he eventually moved on and his spiritual life began you know and it was part of his spiritual life but like that that kind of processing wasn't really part of what was necessary anymore and I said what what told you that it was time to move on to the next to the next thing he said and he said well the point came where number one I felt pretty coherent inside you know pretty decently put together and then I just one day I just recognized I could do this forever I could do this forever and it wasn't like a resistance it was just oh I could do this even when I feel pretty whole and more or less complete and so I could I could refine this endlessly and he said at the moment I realized that I just realized oh I guess I'm done with that orientation for now you never know if it's going to show up six months later or a year later or not but and it's very much like that it's something like that were you just kind of low like oh there seems to have been a certain amount of resolution and an acknowledgement that I could you could refine it indefinitely but you just feel the time when it's kind of like okay it's done or at least done for now it's a very intuitive thing it's a Vinnitsa has it and it's a very simple kind of feeling does that make sense yes that's very helpful I wanted a kind of a navigation tool for once a better word and I think that you've just given it to me I have a feeling that that time may be approaching I'm not a hundred percent certain that I have this feeling that my intuition is kicking in and starting to say that it might be time to something else for a while I don't know if it's startin time for something else for a while so I think that's why I needed to call you to say yeah I got four tot just when you were when you first were talking I kind of got the feeling that that was that was going to be coming and not too terrible long also yeah yeah so and yeah I think when it went it really when it does show up you'll just kind of you'll just kind of know it you know if we prematurely do it then we're like all this is just psychology and I want to move on and you know okay that's too heavy-handed that's not being honest and real and you know but sometimes you can get like so you know some people like being in their psychological process indefinitely is what they want to do and it's like well if that's what you want to do that's okay but there's also a time where it's just sort of feels at a sufficient point of resolution at least for that period of time and and I have no doubt that you you're gonna feel that you're going to know it yep thanks so much for calling I think that that was a particularly good call given given the talk tonight so we could hopefully find that balance point between a healthy and necessarily acknowledgement I can't just go to another one okay I'm gonna go to Melanie in Oregon hi Melanie hey first I want to say thank you so much for your teachings and it's awesome thank y'all sharing that I appreciate it my question is about discerning between the truth and when the mind grabs on to the truth you know when you're saying like the mindless fades that's who I am and instead of being oriented to the truth of like this knowing and I think that I've had spiritual that then turned up overwhelmed the system you know what I mean I know that that can happen in lots of ways can you tell me like a short version of how it overwhelms the system for you then have to say oh you know that might not have been a real spiritual experience maybe that was all just sickness or something but I think of that I moved beyond that you know because I've been looking for the truth for a long time and and that's course had experiences with it especially like in doing art I feel like the self disappears yes and so other experiences as well but and so but there's that just that line of discerning like I think what happens is that my mind grabs on to it and what's the claim that are productive like yes right right and if that happens in a big way and you know it happens mostly spontaneously if it happens in a big way then yeah you can't end up in a sort of a temporary inflated psychosis State right that's the yeah that's the big version but but it's I mean I've seen that happen to people any number of times so it's it's it's not super common but it's also not super unusual so once you start to okay you've seen that like you've gone through through that like oh there's something in me that just kind of spontaneously can have that tendency that that grasp onto that you know and and and can inflate itself so okay so there's there's this balance point isn't there between a willingness to allow a new recognition of truth of your being in right to allow it in and to let yourself kind of know it but also not to how can I say know it but not to overly claim it know it without being inflated by it that's the key as soon as you start to feel the inflation like whoa look how special I am you know if you say that very it can start very subtly can and very innocently but as soon as you kind of feel that or well I'm I'm awake and she everyone else is asleep and gee that's pretty cool those it's often starts at these very subtle seemingly innocent thoughts but if you when you see those now you'll just be able to look at them more and go oh okay I don't need to touch that thought that's not necessary that's not necessary like I know where that can lead sincerely on guard yeah yeah yeah yeah cuz you you learn from your experience right right that's I know when you've had those you know if you've had any kind of sake psychotic episode that it can often lead you with to a lack of trust I understand that you know but the the things that can help it help you be more safe with it is to realize that yeah I can I can learn from my experience and that's to help me help my experience stay more safe so that's a useful thing I've been through this I might it might make me a little afraid I don't that you don't want to go through that again right but at least you go okay I have been through it though I dunno what I grasped on to and I dunno what inflated itself and if it ever happens again I can spot it right away and what I would always suggest is if if you if you spot it really recognize it right away you know without letting it kind of blossom and blossom and blossom because you know how it gets this momentum right and pretty much before you know it the momentum is sort of taking you over a little bit so there's that difference between oh this is what I am oh okay how lovely is that and that inflated part right which because the difference between even you know genuine awakenings can turn into sort of inflation's or even psychotic episodes but what the the thread that the difference becomes is when if your realization starts to make you feel in any way special that's the tip-off right you know that you feel wonderful and more free and more fully yourself in a true sense that's great that's all that's all natural but as soon as it starts to make you feel special because then you know that's that's the beginning of separation right that's the ego-mind claiming because and I think if you look back or if you look into like the very first happenings or even let's go white like while you're painting right and you kind of get lost you get your the self just disappears and it's just the painting happening right there's no inflation in that is there that's it it's much more like that yeah but if you imagine that you kind of were we're lost in the painting and you painted and then you put your brushes down and you went back and of course you appreciate it if it's a nice painting you go wow that looks really quite amazing but then imagine you went and Wow and I'm that I guess I'm the best painter in the world I must be the best painter that God has ever produced or it if you're just right that's very different than just going wow that's a lovely amazing painting that came from somewhere beyond where in certain aspects is easy but then you know and talk about letting go and fears that come up with letting go mm-hmm I think that's you know the fear that comes up for me yeah I understand that I understand that and you know you you'll be there's letting go there's letting go and then there's how can I say it there's a letting go that's really just kind of equivalent to a letting be and then there's a letting go that's sort of it's like you're trying to throw something off really it's a kind of there's a different quality it's a letting go that destabilizes you now one of the reasons traditionally for something like meditation if done right if done well is over time it creates a psychological stability within you so that when these big experiences happen if the stability has been created it's they're less likely to knock you totally off balance yeah that can't that can be that can be that can be helpful I mean that's one of the big reasons why it was even there to begin with think people think it's only there to help them open it is there to help them open but it's also there again if done if done in the right way it can really create a kind of cycle it can add to a kind of psychological stability if done in the wrong way it can actually deep destabilize the psyche and prone it to you know losing its balance so if you notice that your psyche sometimes can get destabilized if you do do meditation I would really focus on a meditation that's not necessarily just opening to the pure space of being or pure space of awareness I'll often have people do that meditation but instead I would have a meditation where you're just very it's still very light but you're more focused way down and like the bottom part of your belly and you're just breathing and that becomes the object and you'll find that that kind of meditation actually creates this sort of stability in you I call it it's like accessing a mountain of emptiness rather than when you're in a like a really expanded awareness kind of meditation that's kind of like the transparency of awareness but down your gut it creates a kind of stability and I think it might be really useful for you if you haven't yeah I tried I'm not doing it every day you know doing it on a daily basis it'll help but think of it even if you did it don't don't don't you know bite off so much that you kind of guarantee your failure to do it daily you know what I mean go like well okay I'm gonna set a goal I'll do at least five minutes a day right like what day can't you do five minutes of silence right if you think a half an hour I mean sure that might be ideal but you just be reasonable with yourself and go well if I keep failing at that let me down scale it to the point where I stop failing you know why not I was at the resurrection Jesus retreat Lamar yeah and then meditation was so easy there was amazing to it for 40 minutes and it seemed like the time with our you know yeah well that's one of the reasons that people you know that people have gathered to do that because there's a kind of collective energy and a collective focus that's helpful yeah but you you know you you can come to that on your own – yeah the key is you know think of it like a half hour every three day if you think five minutes every day is a better than a half hour every three days it really is you go geez how could how can five minutes be worthy but you there's this kind of little momentum thing that you build daily that's even better than if you only do it like twice a week but you do it for an hour you'd be better off of scaling it back and doing a little bit more daily you know and then then you'd have the benefit of you don't feel like you wouldn't feel like a failure right by g-time meditating for twice the time it takes me to brush my teeth in the morning that that's not a hell of a lot yeah and you'll be a surprise if any any amount that you do do daily it's you know after two or three weeks it starts to take on a momentum it really does and the consistency is actually more important than the actual time spent doing it okay yeah thanks for calling in my friend thank you nice to talk with you okay bye-bye okay here we go okay I'll go to the last caller Busan and Utah hi hi idea did I get your name right he's on yeah cause it's close enough thank you thank you for such a wonderful talk tonight and thank you for thank you for doing it there was something you said about a neutrality assisted Airmen life I don't know what you said exactly after but you pointed to have a no separation between life and the spiritual life and I just got it in that moment you know it's like so obvious so apparent and my question is um what do you suggest for you know very heavy me like a very heavy South Delta you don't regret sent and I've heard you speak about regrets but but just a very heavy me trying to connect that yeah yeah thanks for that question it's a good question of all I would get familiar it really really identify the ways that the me talks to itself that makes it feel the heaviest or the most regretful or because usually well not only usually but almost always there's these really well-worn sort of patterns of self-talk that are a big part of what generates the the bigger aspects of suffering for the me and so the first the first thing is start to you kind of make a instead of trying to escape it make a study of it like what is what patterns of of underline thinking and therefore underline feeling because if you really look what you feel will also include certain thoughts that are helping to sustain the feeling so I would really get really familiar with like the the negative part of the self-talk just make that a study to begin they're like okay I'm gonna really see what I keep thinking to myself what are the old narratives what are the old sort of self-talk lines that that seem to be repeating start there okay that's a beginning then you start to identify because until you identify them and usually the best way to do it is you start to write some of them down you know don't you don't have to make a big expose I mean you can write them down in a a sentence you know da da da da da data I mean that can be very very simple and I often suggest people write them down because otherwise they just turning your head right and you forget the one you saw yesterday and it keeps catching you because you forgot about it but after you get some of them down you know and you got you know a couple of pages of your favorite depressing lines the way you're the way you you were conditioned to talk to yourself that make you feel the worst and there they are on paper something about having them on paper already starts to sort of creates distance because then you can see them and go of course I feel this way anybody that was entertaining these thoughts would feel that way you know what I mean when you get them on paper you'll go all of course I've feel feel the way I do because I've I've had this pattern I was taught to think this way oh and these are specifically the things I think and then you start to recognize that your feelings and your thoughts are like two sides of the same thing it's like two sides of a coin one sides the thought one sides the feeling and oh they're exactly sort of the same thing just two different faces right so then you but now you've got them so they're not moving just in your head you can see them you can reference them anytime you want you can go back to them and then you can just that will often you'll start to notice a certain psychological distance from the thoughts and often from the feeling just a little bit of space just from clearly cleanly identifying some of the patterns some of the pattern thinking just that will usually create a little bit of psychological space and in that space then you can start to kind of inquire like okay that's the thought that's generating that feeling or that's the memory or whatever now is I appear to be believing that thought my feeling is proof that I'm believing it that's how I know I'm believing it because I feel it because you think lots of thoughts in a given day most thoughts that go through your head you don't believe him you hardly even notice him so you don't feel them at all they're just random little psychological noises that go through but then there's the other ones that you've been trained to go that one that's relevant that's you and that's true and that's what you need to identify and then you go back and you ask the question okay what I've been what I have been trained what I have been taught is that that thought is true and that it is me even if you're psycho psychological reading in books and stuff has said that you know otherwise right because we're getting down to something other than what you think we're getting down to a more unconscious level right that that thought that's what I think that's what I believe then you can start to question it like what if I didn't believe the thought what might be a thought that's more true than the one I currently have in my head from the start there then you can you can then you can finally jump off outside a thought altogether but often it's easier like if you have some regretful thought about the past oh I shouldn't have done that boy what a screw-up I was how could I have possibly been better data okay so you see that oh I'm telling myself that damn thought all the time no wonder I feel regret mate what what would be something that's even more true than that like something like oh well apparently I didn't know better because I did it if I knew better I wouldn't have done the thing I'm regretting but apparently I didn't know deeply enough right if I knew deeply enough I apparently probably wouldn't have done it so I didn't know deep enough I might have known but I didn't know deep enough and so there you go I do something oh well maybe I can join the rest of the human family right we've all screwed up you me every one of us have done a laundry list of unconscious things right all right you I could look back in my past and me and you could compare notes you know we could fill a notebook with with the dumb stupid things that probably have done and that's part of taking this out of secret because when you have those things that you regret they're like these are the little secrets inside instead of going hey man join the human family everybody has a whole host of those things but apparently I wasn't conscious enough at the time okay but hey now I am I'm conscious enough to notice it well that's kind of cool maybe I'm conscious enough not to repeat it that's kind of cool can I forgive that's the big one isn't it yeah and I forgive and let me give you a key to forgiveness treat yourself as how would you treat yourself and I want you to ask yourself this question many times how would I treat myself right now if I was someone that I deeply cared about that'll change everything yeah because usually when you when you have regret or blame or something you're treating yours what you notice is I'm treating myself like somebody I don't care about at all in fact I'm treating myself just like I would treat somebody that I really didn't like very well I'm just I'm just showering myself with endless blame but what would it be like if I was to treat myself like somebody I deeply cared about what would I say to myself then you see it's you can change as the environment almost immediately Oh cuz that's what that's what you're taught who sign you're taught not to treat yourself like something like you are someone you care about you're taught to treat yourself as someone that you endlessly judge did you get what I'm saying yeah and if you ever forget it imagine that somebody else somebody else a friend has the exact same experience you have they've they have the exact same past imagine it's it's a duplicate and that great friend the friend you love and care about comes to you and says I thought what do I do about this now at that moment you are you gonna see how you're gonna care for your friend you'll care for them you Blake jeez I'm that must be terrible to suffer like that I'm really sorry you have to go through that you'd immediately care if it was somebody else went you that's it yeah that's the different that's the different citation standard that's right that's right that's right and this is and I know some people don't understand me when I say this but it's all when we're overly self judgmental it's like a hidden arrogance oh yeah right because it's it's kind of like I'm unwilling to see myself as that fallible that's pretty instead of like well I guess I'm like most all the rest of human beings and I do plenty of dumb things I'm not using as a excuse but maybe I come off my high horse and stop being so damn hard on myself now that's humility right you just you're you're kind of like oh I'm like everybody else yeah you know you get what I say in yeah I would start there treat yourself as if you were someone you do Glee cared about you know even your mind even the you know spiritual people are so good at being really harsh with themselves like all my damn thoughts and I don't want to have those thoughts and I don't one of those feelings and I'll never stop being stopped my mind or slow it down and and it's like way way way way way what if you're sitting there and you actually treat that mind as if it's something you really care about right then it's like oh you poor thing you endlessly thinking thing gee that must be really tough huh and all of a sudden there's this softness of environment that comes to you yeah it's like an awareness almost what's on the other side of that about wholeness it's it's really wrong yeah my interaction with life that's what it is that's what it is it's really raw it's really direct yeah it's what is without my judgment yeah and you know not only into yourself but then give the gift to the world – yeah oh I won't be the judgmental God the world hmm that might work out pretty good we human beings seem to do a lot of that – I know who you should be I know how you should be that it is right I could call it the ego playing God so when you're harsh with yourself it's also your ego playing God just inward not outward that's right it's just inward its inward right so sometimes the spiritual personality can be really nice outwardly but inwardly not so nice yeah so and that that oak that leads the door that's that's the beginning of forgiveness right yeah forgiveness all right my friend nice to talk with you oh my yeah you're welcome okay okay okay well we only went twenty-five minutes past our time that's not entirely bad for me um so just to try to close down the evening I have some a few announcements to give you will be doing another light broadcast and thanks for participating and joining me in this this wonderful investigation of the truth of our being and thank you for your support and your donations that go to help support this program and as always if you want to find out any details about what I'm up to or Mookie's up to me you can look at all shanti org which you're probably on right now and mook DS are at Mukti source more so until we meet again be kind be kind to yourself treat yourself like you're someone you care about it can revolutionize your life and then you turn it around and give that back to the world be well you

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